1 00:00:20,312 --> 00:00:22,314 [footsteps approaching] 2 00:00:34,409 --> 00:00:35,911 [Rick Rubin] Let's step into the light. 3 00:00:38,038 --> 00:00:39,373 [bottle thuds] 4 00:00:42,292 --> 00:00:44,336 - [bottles clinking] - [chair scraping] 5 00:00:46,505 --> 00:00:48,756 You up for listening to a bit of music, sir? 6 00:00:48,757 --> 00:00:50,591 - Let's do it. - Let's listen to something. 7 00:00:50,592 --> 00:00:52,093 [♪ "Intro (The Dynasty)" playing] 8 00:00:52,094 --> 00:00:53,511 Hey, that's a nice start. 9 00:00:53,512 --> 00:00:56,014 - [laughing] - That's a great start. 10 00:02:12,924 --> 00:02:14,675 - Man. - That's the "Intro." 11 00:02:14,676 --> 00:02:15,926 [Jay-Z chuckles] 12 00:02:15,927 --> 00:02:17,261 [♪ music stops] 13 00:02:17,262 --> 00:02:19,764 Tell me what comes up when you hear those words. 14 00:02:19,765 --> 00:02:20,973 Oh, man. 15 00:02:20,974 --> 00:02:23,435 Um, just the space. 16 00:02:24,603 --> 00:02:26,980 My favorite intro. Um... 17 00:02:28,482 --> 00:02:30,775 This is after, like, four albums. 18 00:02:30,776 --> 00:02:33,986 This is Dynasty album, which was meant to be a compilation album. 19 00:02:33,987 --> 00:02:37,282 It was just like, you know, that moment of... 20 00:02:38,367 --> 00:02:41,119 the realization of where you come from... 21 00:02:42,037 --> 00:02:43,454 and where you're going. 22 00:02:43,455 --> 00:02:46,332 You thinking like people of means 23 00:02:46,333 --> 00:02:47,958 didn't have problems. 24 00:02:47,959 --> 00:02:49,502 Specifically in this song, 25 00:02:49,503 --> 00:02:52,797 Bill Cosby and, like, speaking of Ennis, 26 00:02:52,798 --> 00:02:55,800 "keen senses ever since I was a teen on the benches, 27 00:02:55,801 --> 00:02:57,677 every time somebody with Ennis was mentioned," 28 00:02:57,678 --> 00:03:01,013 - and Ennis is the name of Cosby's son. - Mm-hmm. 29 00:03:01,014 --> 00:03:03,391 "I would turn green, me being in the trenches, 30 00:03:03,392 --> 00:03:04,642 "him living adventurous, 31 00:03:04,643 --> 00:03:06,143 not worrying about expenditures." 32 00:03:06,144 --> 00:03:08,854 Like, they had no worries 'cause they had money. 33 00:03:08,855 --> 00:03:11,232 And that-- that sorta-- "I would turn green," right? 34 00:03:11,233 --> 00:03:13,984 - Yeah. - Me being jealous of that lifestyle. 35 00:03:13,985 --> 00:03:16,153 "I'm braving temperatures below zero. 36 00:03:16,154 --> 00:03:19,323 No hero, no father figure." Right? These are-- 37 00:03:19,324 --> 00:03:21,492 These-- This was what's going on for me in my life, 38 00:03:21,493 --> 00:03:24,328 and, you know, not growing up with your-- your father. 39 00:03:24,329 --> 00:03:25,997 Well, my father left around 11. 40 00:03:27,332 --> 00:03:29,875 That whole thing I had to re-explore as well, 41 00:03:29,876 --> 00:03:32,211 you know, the dynamic between, like, 42 00:03:32,212 --> 00:03:34,088 you know, myself and my dad. 43 00:03:34,089 --> 00:03:37,842 Um, but just this thought of this criminal world 44 00:03:37,843 --> 00:03:40,594 that I was living in, "the theme song to The Soprano 45 00:03:40,595 --> 00:03:43,514 plays in the key of life," like real life. 46 00:03:43,515 --> 00:03:45,558 And it's a reference to Stevie as well, like... 47 00:03:45,559 --> 00:03:46,684 And then it goes right to Stevie, 48 00:03:46,685 --> 00:03:47,935 "plays in the key of life..." 49 00:03:47,936 --> 00:03:49,520 - Yeah. - "...on my mental piano." 50 00:03:49,521 --> 00:03:51,355 - Incredible. - Like "Stevie Wonder 51 00:03:51,356 --> 00:03:53,107 with beads under the durag," 52 00:03:53,108 --> 00:03:55,818 like just making the comparison to me and Stevie. 53 00:03:55,819 --> 00:03:57,695 And I always wore a durag at that time. 54 00:03:57,696 --> 00:03:59,864 - Yeah. - With no waves. 55 00:03:59,865 --> 00:04:02,199 - [laughing] - "Intuition is there 56 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:04,034 even when my vision's impaired." 57 00:04:04,035 --> 00:04:07,121 Like, you grow up knowing what's gonna happen next. 58 00:04:07,122 --> 00:04:09,206 You grow up knowing 'cause you have a sense 59 00:04:09,207 --> 00:04:11,876 of if this-- these certain things happen 60 00:04:11,877 --> 00:04:14,879 or these guys come into the room and they move in a certain way, 61 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:17,089 you already know how it's gonna play out. 62 00:04:17,090 --> 00:04:18,967 - Mm-hmm. - Because you survived on... 63 00:04:20,218 --> 00:04:21,219 your instincts. 64 00:04:22,095 --> 00:04:24,388 "Intuition is there even when my vision's impaired, 65 00:04:24,389 --> 00:04:26,474 knowing I can go just switching a spare," 66 00:04:26,475 --> 00:04:28,434 knowing how fragile life was. 67 00:04:28,435 --> 00:04:30,728 Ennis had, uh, got murdered. 68 00:04:30,729 --> 00:04:32,313 He pulled over to the side of the road, 69 00:04:32,314 --> 00:04:33,731 he was switching his tire. 70 00:04:33,732 --> 00:04:35,566 And these are the things that were happening at the time. 71 00:04:35,567 --> 00:04:37,234 Oh, so the switching a spare is a reference to-- 72 00:04:37,235 --> 00:04:39,445 "Knowing I can go just switching a spare." 73 00:04:39,446 --> 00:04:41,113 - I had no idea that was a reference to that. - Yeah. 74 00:04:41,114 --> 00:04:42,782 "On the highway of life." 75 00:04:42,783 --> 00:04:45,826 - Visually bringing those two things back. - Incredible. 76 00:04:45,827 --> 00:04:47,620 And so, just drawing these parallels 77 00:04:47,621 --> 00:04:49,914 of how you think, you know, Michael Jordan 78 00:04:49,915 --> 00:04:52,166 and the Bill Cosbys, and all them, 79 00:04:52,167 --> 00:04:54,251 you know, that their life is so much greater 80 00:04:54,252 --> 00:04:55,961 'cause they have money. 81 00:04:55,962 --> 00:04:57,922 You know, I know better now. 82 00:04:57,923 --> 00:04:59,507 - Yeah. - Um, but you think, 83 00:04:59,508 --> 00:05:01,759 "Well, if I had $100, 84 00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:04,178 I wouldn't be complaining about anything." 85 00:05:04,179 --> 00:05:06,347 It's like, mm. 86 00:05:06,348 --> 00:05:07,932 That's not... [chuckles] 87 00:05:07,933 --> 00:05:10,100 You know, everyone has problems, different problems. 88 00:05:10,101 --> 00:05:12,603 - Yeah. - Every-- and I guess the whole, uh, feeling 89 00:05:12,604 --> 00:05:16,357 of everyone thinking the grass is greener on the other side. 90 00:05:16,358 --> 00:05:20,694 That's pretty much what that-- that intro was about, 91 00:05:20,695 --> 00:05:22,279 dealing with that. 92 00:05:22,280 --> 00:05:25,115 You have the reference about the-- The Sopranos, 93 00:05:25,116 --> 00:05:28,327 and throughout the songs there are references 94 00:05:28,328 --> 00:05:32,122 - to television, movies a lot. - Yeah. Yeah. 95 00:05:32,123 --> 00:05:34,208 Would you say it's an inspiration, 96 00:05:34,209 --> 00:05:37,169 or is it just a metaphor that when you say it, 97 00:05:37,170 --> 00:05:39,505 it's like shorthand for the message 98 00:05:39,506 --> 00:05:42,550 - that you're trying to tell? - Well, I love TV and film, 99 00:05:42,551 --> 00:05:44,635 so it always-- it's always back there. 100 00:05:44,636 --> 00:05:46,095 And I know it's shorthand 101 00:05:46,096 --> 00:05:48,055 that if I say the theme song to The Sopranos. 102 00:05:48,056 --> 00:05:49,598 - We know what that is. - We know what that is. 103 00:05:49,599 --> 00:05:52,184 - Yeah. - I don't-- just move on to the next line. 104 00:05:52,185 --> 00:05:54,562 You don't have to explain it and what that is. 105 00:05:54,563 --> 00:05:57,648 And you talk about, "Never read the Quran or Islamic scriptures, 106 00:05:57,649 --> 00:06:00,401 only Psalms written on arms," like... 107 00:06:00,402 --> 00:06:02,736 So, on the arms of Biggie-- 108 00:06:02,737 --> 00:06:07,825 this was a reference-- Biggie, D-Roc, Lil' Cease, 109 00:06:07,826 --> 00:06:10,661 they all have the same, um, Psalm scripture on their arm. 110 00:06:10,662 --> 00:06:11,912 - Really? - Yeah. 111 00:06:11,913 --> 00:06:13,581 They all got the same tattoos. 112 00:06:13,582 --> 00:06:15,165 So, it was a reference to them. 113 00:06:15,166 --> 00:06:18,210 "Only Psalms I read was on the arms of my niggas tattooed." 114 00:06:18,211 --> 00:06:22,923 Like, that was my-my-my-- my, um, learning of religion, 115 00:06:22,924 --> 00:06:24,508 which was a bit of exaggeration 116 00:06:24,509 --> 00:06:26,927 'cause my grandfather was a preacher. 117 00:06:26,928 --> 00:06:29,346 And my grandfather had his demons. 118 00:06:29,347 --> 00:06:32,225 You know, a bunch of demons. He got his, um... 119 00:06:33,518 --> 00:06:35,269 You know, we'll-- we'll get into that. 120 00:06:35,270 --> 00:06:39,440 Where was the line of, um, exaggeration 121 00:06:39,441 --> 00:06:41,275 permissible and not for you? 122 00:06:41,276 --> 00:06:46,113 It was only in painting a-- a picture. 123 00:06:46,114 --> 00:06:50,034 Part of my-- my rule was if it's not about me 124 00:06:50,035 --> 00:06:51,869 or about something that, you know, 125 00:06:51,870 --> 00:06:54,455 my friends went through, I'm not gonna say it. 126 00:06:54,456 --> 00:06:56,415 - Mm-hmm. - I'm not gonna create a beautiful tale 127 00:06:56,416 --> 00:06:58,584 like a Slick Rick would do. 128 00:06:58,585 --> 00:07:00,544 - No fantasy. - There's no fantasy. 129 00:07:00,545 --> 00:07:02,880 Even in, like, storytelling, when I made a song 130 00:07:02,881 --> 00:07:04,423 like, Meet the Parents. 131 00:07:04,424 --> 00:07:07,885 So, Meet the Parents was-- was this song about, um-- 132 00:07:07,886 --> 00:07:09,136 - if you have it there, I won't-- - We do. 133 00:07:09,137 --> 00:07:10,471 - Yeah, that's-- - You wanna hear it? 134 00:07:10,472 --> 00:07:11,555 Yeah. 135 00:07:11,556 --> 00:07:14,559 [♪ "Meet the Parents" playing] 136 00:07:32,327 --> 00:07:33,578 ♪ I got y'all ♪ 137 00:11:10,545 --> 00:11:12,337 - [♪ music ends] - I don't know how you did that. 138 00:11:12,338 --> 00:11:15,465 So, I took a real subject, "Meet the Parents," 139 00:11:15,466 --> 00:11:17,134 like, you know, my father being gone. 140 00:11:17,135 --> 00:11:19,720 So many of our fathers was gone and we're always in the street. 141 00:11:19,721 --> 00:11:21,471 Even our dads was in the street. 142 00:11:21,472 --> 00:11:24,016 So, if you had left early enough, 143 00:11:24,017 --> 00:11:26,059 you would run into yourself somewhere 144 00:11:26,060 --> 00:11:27,519 and not know that that's your son, 145 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:29,521 and the possibility that you could kill your son. 146 00:11:29,522 --> 00:11:33,317 - Yeah. - Because that's what was happening at the time. 147 00:11:33,318 --> 00:11:36,862 So, this is actually a PSA for, like, parenthood. 148 00:11:36,863 --> 00:11:38,113 'Cause you're making a point. 149 00:11:38,114 --> 00:11:39,573 - Making a point. - You wanted to make a point. 150 00:11:39,574 --> 00:11:40,741 I wanted to make a point. 151 00:11:40,742 --> 00:11:42,367 Not just me. Forget me. 152 00:11:42,368 --> 00:11:43,827 Just the whole neighborhood. 153 00:11:43,828 --> 00:11:46,997 Imagine, you know, your brother died, 154 00:11:46,998 --> 00:11:48,999 your father died, your [indistinct] locked up. 155 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:50,792 You start thinking... 156 00:11:50,793 --> 00:11:52,628 - That's what it is. - That's what it is. 157 00:11:52,629 --> 00:11:54,421 - Yeah. - There's no God coming to save us. 158 00:11:54,422 --> 00:11:56,548 There's no superhero coming to save us. 159 00:11:56,549 --> 00:11:58,884 This is like, I gotta do for self. 160 00:11:58,885 --> 00:12:01,261 And you start hardening. 161 00:12:01,262 --> 00:12:03,055 Yeah, you have the line somewhere about, uh, 162 00:12:03,056 --> 00:12:05,349 church is only for atheists. 163 00:12:05,350 --> 00:12:06,975 Oh, that's probably Where I'm From. 164 00:12:06,976 --> 00:12:09,019 - "And the church is the flakiest..." - Yeah, yeah, yeah. 165 00:12:09,020 --> 00:12:11,855 "And we been praying to God so long that we atheist." 166 00:12:11,856 --> 00:12:14,566 You know, it's just like you've been asking for relief... 167 00:12:14,567 --> 00:12:16,735 - Yeah. - ...from this struggle. 168 00:12:16,736 --> 00:12:18,863 And, you know, you don't have the... 169 00:12:21,366 --> 00:12:23,909 - spiritual maturity to know it. - Mm. 170 00:12:23,910 --> 00:12:25,494 That's not how life works. 171 00:12:25,495 --> 00:12:28,038 And you'd go through certain things and you never know why, 172 00:12:28,039 --> 00:12:30,374 but you look back and say, "Man." 173 00:12:30,375 --> 00:12:33,043 - You look back later and say-- - Yeah, makes sense. 174 00:12:33,044 --> 00:12:35,379 - Makes sense. Makes sense. - Yeah. 175 00:12:35,380 --> 00:12:37,214 Just from a technical standpoint, 176 00:12:37,215 --> 00:12:39,716 do you start with the track, or do you ever have an idea 177 00:12:39,717 --> 00:12:42,719 for a song before you hear a track? 178 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:45,973 I think with those two, because I was in the studio, 179 00:12:45,974 --> 00:12:49,393 the track dictated where-- where these two went. 180 00:12:49,394 --> 00:12:50,894 But it happens both ways. 181 00:12:50,895 --> 00:12:53,480 - The mood of the music would inspire. - The mood. Yeah. 182 00:12:53,481 --> 00:12:55,399 If you listen to my songs that have strings... 183 00:12:55,400 --> 00:12:57,401 - Yeah. - ...they're all, like, super melancholy 184 00:12:57,402 --> 00:13:00,404 and, like, introspective, because something about strings 185 00:13:00,405 --> 00:13:03,573 make me, you know, go into, like, story-mode 186 00:13:03,574 --> 00:13:05,742 and it's like... [singing melody] 187 00:13:05,743 --> 00:13:08,578 On this Meet the Parents, it was like immediately, 188 00:13:08,579 --> 00:13:11,415 something about it informs my brain's story. 189 00:13:11,416 --> 00:13:13,959 How similar was your experience 190 00:13:13,960 --> 00:13:16,086 to the experience of the kids in your neighborhood? 191 00:13:16,087 --> 00:13:17,421 Very similar. 192 00:13:17,422 --> 00:13:19,089 Everyone had the same experience, 193 00:13:19,090 --> 00:13:21,508 except I was the one that could stand on the soapbox 194 00:13:21,509 --> 00:13:24,177 and, like, articulate what we were going through. 195 00:13:24,178 --> 00:13:27,014 I think that's what-- that's how I struck a chord. 196 00:13:27,015 --> 00:13:30,100 - Yeah. - There's like, certain details 197 00:13:30,101 --> 00:13:32,978 and certain smells to it that you couldn't know unless-- 198 00:13:32,979 --> 00:13:34,771 - Too specific. - It's too specific. 199 00:13:34,772 --> 00:13:37,607 - Unless you were there, you couldn't know... - Yeah. 200 00:13:37,608 --> 00:13:40,319 ...you know, a handheld weigh scale 201 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:44,114 and what that meant, you know. You had to know. 202 00:13:44,115 --> 00:13:47,117 How would you describe the hip-hop that came before 203 00:13:47,118 --> 00:13:48,994 in comparison to what you were doing? 204 00:13:48,995 --> 00:13:50,787 - You know, especially in the beginning... - Yeah. 205 00:13:50,788 --> 00:13:53,123 ...it was just the stylings of music. 206 00:13:53,124 --> 00:13:56,543 Like, how-- how can I say things, 207 00:13:56,544 --> 00:13:59,129 um, in a very unique way? 208 00:13:59,130 --> 00:14:01,923 - Mm-hmm. - Rakim came with multi-syllables, 209 00:14:01,924 --> 00:14:05,052 and then Kool G Rap said, "No, I got even more multi-syllable." 210 00:14:05,053 --> 00:14:08,055 And then Kane was like, "No, but I have song structure." 211 00:14:08,056 --> 00:14:09,848 - Yeah. - Obviously, Melle Mel 212 00:14:09,849 --> 00:14:12,976 came and did The Message, and that was a major moment 213 00:14:12,977 --> 00:14:15,228 where we were like, oh, 214 00:14:15,229 --> 00:14:18,815 this could do more than just "I'm the best, I'm the best." 215 00:14:18,816 --> 00:14:21,318 Do you remember when you first heard The Message? 216 00:14:21,319 --> 00:14:24,488 I don't know where I was, but I do remember the feeling 217 00:14:24,489 --> 00:14:26,114 and the time, you know. 218 00:14:26,115 --> 00:14:28,742 My mom and pop had a huge record collection. 219 00:14:28,743 --> 00:14:30,744 I actually heard-- my first rap record 220 00:14:30,745 --> 00:14:32,704 was something like King Tut III 221 00:14:32,705 --> 00:14:34,164 or King Tim, something like that. 222 00:14:34,165 --> 00:14:35,999 King Tim or King T-- It was a green label. 223 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:38,043 - Mm-hmm. - I remember that. 224 00:14:38,044 --> 00:14:40,670 My first rap record I ever heard was from my mom. 225 00:14:40,671 --> 00:14:42,214 Wow. 226 00:14:42,215 --> 00:14:44,091 [chuckles] Yeah, because they had-- 227 00:14:44,092 --> 00:14:46,510 you know, they built this wall unit. 228 00:14:46,511 --> 00:14:49,054 We didn't have much money, so they had, like, milk crates, 229 00:14:49,055 --> 00:14:51,181 - like iron crates. - Yeah. 230 00:14:51,182 --> 00:14:54,393 And I guess this was definitely normal then, right? 231 00:14:54,394 --> 00:14:56,103 - That's what you carried your records in. - Yeah. 232 00:14:56,104 --> 00:14:58,355 So, they have, like, iron crates on both sides, 233 00:14:58,356 --> 00:15:01,400 then took like a plywood, put it on top, 234 00:15:01,401 --> 00:15:04,194 then put another set, and then put the speakers, 235 00:15:04,195 --> 00:15:06,363 and then on top had like a reel-to-reel. 236 00:15:06,364 --> 00:15:07,864 [Rick] Mm-hmm. 237 00:15:07,865 --> 00:15:10,075 Um, I didn't even know how great that was back then. 238 00:15:10,076 --> 00:15:12,119 I was just like, what's the big thing up there? 239 00:15:12,120 --> 00:15:14,037 - And I never used it. - What was the music 240 00:15:14,038 --> 00:15:15,372 that was playing in your house growing up? 241 00:15:15,373 --> 00:15:17,707 Everything. Uh, Prince, 242 00:15:17,708 --> 00:15:20,127 Michael Jackson, Stevie, 243 00:15:20,128 --> 00:15:21,920 - Ohio Players. - Mm-hmm. 244 00:15:21,921 --> 00:15:24,881 O'Jays, Supremes, 245 00:15:24,882 --> 00:15:26,883 - Richard Pryor's albums. - Yeah. Yeah. 246 00:15:26,884 --> 00:15:30,053 I heard all my curse words from Richard Pryor. 247 00:15:30,054 --> 00:15:31,888 - Redd Foxx album. - Yeah, fantastic. 248 00:15:31,889 --> 00:15:33,390 - Um... - I had Redd Foxx's album. 249 00:15:33,391 --> 00:15:34,975 And I've said this before, but it was-- 250 00:15:34,976 --> 00:15:38,228 it was always fascinating to me that my parents shared kids, 251 00:15:38,229 --> 00:15:40,230 but their names were on the records. 252 00:15:40,231 --> 00:15:42,399 - I was like-- - Well, it tells you how much they cared about it. 253 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:44,985 Yeah. It had, like, you know, like, plastic covers. 254 00:15:44,986 --> 00:15:46,903 - Yeah. - Like, everything was in its cover. 255 00:15:46,904 --> 00:15:49,114 There was nothing out. You pull it out, 256 00:15:49,115 --> 00:15:51,825 and a sticker was on the corner, "Lulu." 257 00:15:51,826 --> 00:15:53,410 That's what we call my mother, Lil Lulu. 258 00:15:53,411 --> 00:15:54,953 - Her name is Gloria Carter. - Yeah. 259 00:15:54,954 --> 00:15:58,081 She had "Lulu," and then my father had "AJ." 260 00:15:58,082 --> 00:16:01,001 That was his name, Adnis Reeves Jr., "AJ." 261 00:16:01,002 --> 00:16:03,628 And they just had their names on every single one of their-- 262 00:16:03,629 --> 00:16:06,006 - That's incredible. - Their records, their vinyls. 263 00:16:06,007 --> 00:16:08,467 Was that the thing of most value in your house? 264 00:16:08,468 --> 00:16:10,093 - Oh, by far. - The record collection. 265 00:16:10,094 --> 00:16:11,803 - Oh, by far. By far. - Yeah. 266 00:16:11,804 --> 00:16:13,346 'Cause it was everything. It was the center 267 00:16:13,347 --> 00:16:15,098 - of our universe. - Mm. 268 00:16:15,099 --> 00:16:16,975 Everyone came to my house, right? 269 00:16:16,976 --> 00:16:18,268 - 'Cause we had all the records. - Yeah. 270 00:16:18,269 --> 00:16:20,145 And people would come there and party. 271 00:16:20,146 --> 00:16:23,691 I remember my house being a house of sports and music. 272 00:16:24,609 --> 00:16:27,611 You know, Sundays, you know, you smelled Pine-Sol 273 00:16:27,612 --> 00:16:30,447 or Ajax in the-- in the house, you know, 274 00:16:30,448 --> 00:16:33,783 which I kinda figured out that as well with my mom. 275 00:16:33,784 --> 00:16:36,454 There was like this incessant cleaning. 276 00:16:37,455 --> 00:16:40,624 Like, and it was just her trying to control her little space. 277 00:16:40,625 --> 00:16:42,292 - Mm. - The whole world around her 278 00:16:42,293 --> 00:16:44,169 was dirty and-- or looked down on her. 279 00:16:44,170 --> 00:16:46,963 - And out of her control. - And out of her control. 280 00:16:46,964 --> 00:16:49,716 And that's the thing that she can control, her household. 281 00:16:49,717 --> 00:16:51,676 - Yeah. - We lived in the projects. 282 00:16:51,677 --> 00:16:54,804 You know, it might be, you know, broken bottles outside 283 00:16:54,805 --> 00:16:57,140 and dope needles, but in her space, 284 00:16:57,141 --> 00:16:59,017 the space that she can control, 285 00:16:59,018 --> 00:17:00,644 it was super clean. 286 00:17:00,645 --> 00:17:01,978 - Mm. - It was always clean. 287 00:17:01,979 --> 00:17:04,981 We always had like a-- a schedule 288 00:17:04,982 --> 00:17:08,485 of our chores, of like, "Wednesday, you do the dishes," 289 00:17:08,486 --> 00:17:11,321 and ah, this, and "You take out the garbage 290 00:17:11,322 --> 00:17:12,697 and you sweep the floor." 291 00:17:12,698 --> 00:17:15,033 There were a lot of, like, angst over that 292 00:17:15,034 --> 00:17:16,993 and discipline over that, I mean, my mom 293 00:17:16,994 --> 00:17:20,497 was just always on me about the way I swept the floor. 294 00:17:20,498 --> 00:17:23,542 She like this-- almost like this military upbringing 295 00:17:23,543 --> 00:17:25,002 when it came to cleaning. 296 00:17:26,045 --> 00:17:28,589 Yeah. I'm picturing it. 297 00:17:30,591 --> 00:17:34,094 And then, so I would-- it was sports. 298 00:17:34,095 --> 00:17:35,762 Everyone would come, they'd be cooking, 299 00:17:35,763 --> 00:17:39,057 Pine-Sol cleaning, windows open and music. 300 00:17:39,058 --> 00:17:41,393 - Mm. - You know, after the sports and the music start, 301 00:17:41,394 --> 00:17:43,562 and then they would have like a little red light situation 302 00:17:43,563 --> 00:17:46,147 in the living room where we, like, sneak out the back room 303 00:17:46,148 --> 00:17:49,192 and be peeking and, you know, they rolling they little joints, 304 00:17:49,193 --> 00:17:50,777 - you know, on the vinyl cover. - Yeah. 305 00:17:50,778 --> 00:17:52,529 Back then, they had terrible weed, 306 00:17:52,530 --> 00:17:54,447 - so it was like seeds, all the seeds in the weed. - Yeah. 307 00:17:54,448 --> 00:17:57,200 So, you had to, like, take the-- the bamboo paper, 308 00:17:57,201 --> 00:18:00,120 and, like, my mom would let me do this as a kid. 309 00:18:00,121 --> 00:18:02,247 She trusted me as-- as an-- as an adult 310 00:18:02,248 --> 00:18:03,873 really early, I think about that often. 311 00:18:03,874 --> 00:18:05,875 - Why do you think that was? - I think she knew. 312 00:18:05,876 --> 00:18:08,545 It was like, "He's-- he's mature enough to handle it." 313 00:18:08,546 --> 00:18:10,213 Like, she-- she really trusted me. 314 00:18:10,214 --> 00:18:11,923 I was away from my house at 16. 315 00:18:11,924 --> 00:18:13,800 - I was in Trenton, New Jersey... - Mm. 316 00:18:13,801 --> 00:18:16,553 ...living away from my mom for months. 317 00:18:16,554 --> 00:18:18,263 Months. Sixteen. 318 00:18:18,264 --> 00:18:20,807 - Yeah. - So, I remember seeing 319 00:18:20,808 --> 00:18:24,811 the Sugarhill Gang in my house 320 00:18:24,812 --> 00:18:27,355 on the first time when they were on, um... 321 00:18:27,356 --> 00:18:29,608 - American Bandstand, maybe? - Soul Train. 322 00:18:29,609 --> 00:18:31,401 - Soul Train. - So, Soul Train. 323 00:18:31,402 --> 00:18:32,820 And I remember being like... 324 00:18:35,072 --> 00:18:36,573 It was odd to me. 325 00:18:36,574 --> 00:18:37,991 Like, what are they doing on there? 326 00:18:37,992 --> 00:18:40,410 So, that was the first time you saw people rapping? 327 00:18:40,411 --> 00:18:43,163 - On TV, definitely. - But you'd seen them rapping 328 00:18:43,164 --> 00:18:44,748 - in the street before? - Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 329 00:18:44,749 --> 00:18:47,000 'Cause they-- we used to have, like, little block parties 330 00:18:47,001 --> 00:18:49,044 where they would, like, plug into, like, the lamppost. 331 00:18:49,045 --> 00:18:52,088 So, there was always, like, music outside. 332 00:18:52,089 --> 00:18:55,425 Around nine is when I start, like, trying to like... 333 00:18:55,426 --> 00:18:56,843 - DJ. - DJ. 334 00:18:56,844 --> 00:18:58,971 I think that's everyone's entry, um... 335 00:19:00,598 --> 00:19:02,932 Then, start writing. Then, I would start writing. 336 00:19:02,933 --> 00:19:04,768 Around nine is when I caught the bug 337 00:19:04,769 --> 00:19:06,978 of like, I remember clearly, 338 00:19:06,979 --> 00:19:09,147 distinctly, like, being obsessed. 339 00:19:09,148 --> 00:19:11,317 Like, write-- I would write every day. 340 00:19:12,860 --> 00:19:15,779 Every day, every day, writing, just writing, just writing. 341 00:19:15,780 --> 00:19:18,615 And would you write rhymes, or would you write songs? 342 00:19:18,616 --> 00:19:20,158 - I would write rhymes. - Rhymes. 343 00:19:20,159 --> 00:19:22,494 - I didn't really understand song structure... - Yeah. 344 00:19:22,495 --> 00:19:23,995 ...or anything like that yet, just long-- 345 00:19:23,996 --> 00:19:26,289 - Just cool rhymes. - Long raps, yeah. 346 00:19:26,290 --> 00:19:29,542 And I wrote so much that my mom bought me this, uh, 347 00:19:29,543 --> 00:19:33,463 green little-- I wish I had it-- this green little, um, binder. 348 00:19:33,464 --> 00:19:35,674 It was almost like it was-- it was made. 349 00:19:35,675 --> 00:19:39,302 It was like, you know, big gold, um, paperclips, 350 00:19:39,303 --> 00:19:41,179 I guess is what you call 'em when you bend 'em over. 351 00:19:41,180 --> 00:19:42,722 - Mm-hmm. - They would come through, 352 00:19:42,723 --> 00:19:44,307 and had, like, three of those. 353 00:19:44,308 --> 00:19:46,476 And the-- and the sheets of paper 354 00:19:46,477 --> 00:19:47,978 didn't have lines on it. 355 00:19:48,813 --> 00:19:51,481 So, like, the songs would be like sideways, 356 00:19:51,482 --> 00:19:53,483 the whole thing, like, they had no structure. 357 00:19:53,484 --> 00:19:55,485 And then, I would write really small-- 358 00:19:55,486 --> 00:19:56,903 - So it was like drawing paper... - Yeah. 359 00:19:56,904 --> 00:19:58,363 - ...more than writing paper. - Drawing paper. 360 00:19:58,364 --> 00:19:59,739 - It was drawing paper, yeah. - Yeah. 361 00:19:59,740 --> 00:20:01,991 And I would just write and write, and then just-- 362 00:20:01,992 --> 00:20:05,161 You know, I had this thing about people seeing what I wrote, 363 00:20:05,162 --> 00:20:07,497 so I would write really small and then I'd cross it out, 364 00:20:07,498 --> 00:20:10,667 and write, like, almost like in a decoded way 365 00:20:10,668 --> 00:20:12,711 so only I can, like, read it. 366 00:20:12,712 --> 00:20:16,339 When did you start memorizing instead of writing it down? 367 00:20:16,340 --> 00:20:19,760 So, say from nine to 15... 368 00:20:20,845 --> 00:20:22,846 just wrote and wrote. 369 00:20:22,847 --> 00:20:26,015 Once I got to Trenton, I was in the streets then. 370 00:20:26,016 --> 00:20:27,517 It was way different. 371 00:20:27,518 --> 00:20:30,186 - Tell me about it. - From nine to 15, I'm home. 372 00:20:30,187 --> 00:20:32,188 - Yeah, writing. - I'm writing and going to talent shows 373 00:20:32,189 --> 00:20:33,690 and writing with Jaz. 374 00:20:33,691 --> 00:20:34,900 When did you meet Jaz? How old were you? 375 00:20:36,068 --> 00:20:38,862 I wanna say right before I left. 376 00:20:38,863 --> 00:20:40,697 - Fifteen-ish? - Yeah. 377 00:20:40,698 --> 00:20:43,616 And we met 'cause everyone was like, "This new guy is really good." 378 00:20:43,617 --> 00:20:46,035 And it was like, "No, this guy's the best in the projects." 379 00:20:46,036 --> 00:20:47,871 And we were meant to battle, and, you know, 380 00:20:47,872 --> 00:20:49,289 it was like a mutual respect. 381 00:20:49,290 --> 00:20:51,207 He was like, "Man, he is good." 382 00:20:51,208 --> 00:20:53,793 And we just started, like, writing together. 383 00:20:53,794 --> 00:20:55,545 - Then it was just-- - Yeah, talk about battling a little bit, 384 00:20:55,546 --> 00:20:57,255 'cause that's an interesting part of the culture. 385 00:20:57,256 --> 00:20:59,299 - Yeah. - Rap battles. 386 00:20:59,300 --> 00:21:02,427 You had to prove that you were good enough 387 00:21:02,428 --> 00:21:06,556 to get on the-- the mic at block parties. 388 00:21:06,557 --> 00:21:07,932 You know, like at the block party, 389 00:21:07,933 --> 00:21:09,726 they ain't gonna just throw somebody up there. 390 00:21:09,727 --> 00:21:11,936 You-- you know, you could ruin the vibe of the party. 391 00:21:11,937 --> 00:21:13,980 - Yeah. - Like, any DJ wanna make sure 392 00:21:13,981 --> 00:21:16,983 that the MC saying something really good 393 00:21:16,984 --> 00:21:18,943 - while he's playing music for me. - Yeah, so it was like a-- 394 00:21:18,944 --> 00:21:20,862 - It was like a tryout almost. - Yeah. Yeah. 395 00:21:20,863 --> 00:21:23,406 You had to battle to be like, "Oh, he's the best one. 396 00:21:23,407 --> 00:21:24,574 He can go up there." 397 00:21:24,575 --> 00:21:26,576 So, there's no rap records yet. 398 00:21:26,577 --> 00:21:29,078 - This is a local-- - There are rap records, 399 00:21:29,079 --> 00:21:32,791 but it's not, like-- it's not ubiquitous. 400 00:21:32,792 --> 00:21:35,251 They're like, like I said-- it's King Tut III 401 00:21:35,252 --> 00:21:38,254 - and Jimmy Spicer. - And one independent record. 402 00:21:38,255 --> 00:21:40,089 - Yes, yeah. It had-- - Yeah, not anything you'd hear 403 00:21:40,090 --> 00:21:42,509 - on the radio ever. - No radio. 404 00:21:42,510 --> 00:21:44,594 I remember when Hot 97 turned over 405 00:21:44,595 --> 00:21:45,929 - from like a Latin station. - Yeah. 406 00:21:45,930 --> 00:21:48,431 I was in the car with my-- my cousin Briant. 407 00:21:48,432 --> 00:21:50,975 - Yeah. - We call him "Bee-High." 408 00:21:50,976 --> 00:21:53,311 And um, he was like, "Yo, this-- this thing 409 00:21:53,312 --> 00:21:55,021 is turning all rap at noon," 410 00:21:55,022 --> 00:21:56,523 - or whatever time it-- - How shocking was that? 411 00:21:56,524 --> 00:21:58,274 - It was unbelievable. - I mean, coming from 412 00:21:58,275 --> 00:22:02,237 the most, uh, fringe... 413 00:22:02,238 --> 00:22:05,782 - Yes, yeah. Yeah. - ...small underground movement. 414 00:22:05,783 --> 00:22:08,451 - Yeah, you had to find a club. - Yeah. Or I remember 415 00:22:08,452 --> 00:22:11,454 if I wanted to buy a 12-inch, I had to go to the Bronx. 416 00:22:11,455 --> 00:22:13,122 - Brad's Record Den in the Bronx... - Yeah. 417 00:22:13,123 --> 00:22:15,250 - ...was the only place that sold records. - Wow, yeah. 418 00:22:15,251 --> 00:22:18,127 - That's incredible. Yeah. - Yeah, it was a real underground movement. 419 00:22:18,128 --> 00:22:19,838 - Yeah. - And it feels like 420 00:22:19,839 --> 00:22:22,550 any of the people who started loving it then... 421 00:22:23,509 --> 00:22:27,136 there couldn't have been any aspiration attached to it... 422 00:22:27,137 --> 00:22:29,472 - Right. - ...because there was no upside. 423 00:22:29,473 --> 00:22:31,057 - Exactly. - You only did this 424 00:22:31,058 --> 00:22:32,642 - 'cause you loved it. - Yeah, although... 425 00:22:32,643 --> 00:22:34,853 - Tell me. - The minute I realized, 426 00:22:34,854 --> 00:22:38,565 "Oh, this is a business," was like '88, '89. 427 00:22:38,566 --> 00:22:40,650 - Yeah, that makes sense. - And, you know, Kane and them were out, 428 00:22:40,651 --> 00:22:43,027 but I'm saying, Jaz got a deal 429 00:22:43,028 --> 00:22:44,654 - with EMI Records. - Mm-hmm. 430 00:22:44,655 --> 00:22:47,198 And because EMI didn't h-have rap, 431 00:22:47,199 --> 00:22:49,576 they didn't-- they had The O'Jays and things like that, 432 00:22:49,577 --> 00:22:52,162 they didn't know to treat him like a rapper. 433 00:22:53,205 --> 00:22:55,331 So, they gave him a-- a recording budget 434 00:22:55,332 --> 00:22:57,876 for $400,000. 435 00:22:57,877 --> 00:23:00,879 And when he told me, I was like... "What?" 436 00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:04,841 - [laughing] - "$400,000 to do this? To rap?" 437 00:23:04,842 --> 00:23:08,428 How hard would you have to work to earn $400,000... 438 00:23:08,429 --> 00:23:10,054 - I know. - ...in the actual world 439 00:23:10,055 --> 00:23:11,764 - at that point in time? - Exactly, yeah. 440 00:23:11,765 --> 00:23:13,433 - I mean... - Not doable, right? 441 00:23:13,434 --> 00:23:14,684 - Well... - Difficult. 442 00:23:14,685 --> 00:23:16,561 You had to be in the underworld, right? 443 00:23:16,562 --> 00:23:18,187 - That can happen there. - Yeah. 444 00:23:18,188 --> 00:23:21,858 You had to risk your life daily and risk your freedom. 445 00:23:21,859 --> 00:23:23,359 - Yes. - You know, there's legends 446 00:23:23,360 --> 00:23:24,944 in the street that people "celebrate" 447 00:23:24,945 --> 00:23:26,446 - for, like, being kingpins... - Yes. 448 00:23:26,447 --> 00:23:29,366 ...that's never seen $400,000, for sure. 449 00:23:30,242 --> 00:23:32,535 Most people at the end of their run 450 00:23:32,536 --> 00:23:35,580 would've been better with a, like, a-- a regular job. 451 00:23:35,581 --> 00:23:38,374 The amount of hours, like, you just standing out there. 452 00:23:38,375 --> 00:23:41,252 - It was no nine to five. - If you amortize the hours... 453 00:23:41,253 --> 00:23:43,254 - Yeah. - ...the potential downside... 454 00:23:43,255 --> 00:23:45,048 - Exactly. - ...it's not worth it. 455 00:23:45,049 --> 00:23:46,925 - It's not worth it. It really isn't. - Yeah. 456 00:23:46,926 --> 00:23:49,761 It's worth it for maybe 1% of the people. 457 00:23:49,762 --> 00:23:51,429 It sounds like you didn't choose it. 458 00:23:51,430 --> 00:23:52,805 It was what was available. 459 00:23:52,806 --> 00:23:54,641 Yeah. It was like air. 460 00:23:54,642 --> 00:23:56,601 It was everywhere. It was the path. 461 00:23:56,602 --> 00:23:58,978 - Yeah. - You know, and before you get to map your life out, 462 00:23:58,979 --> 00:24:00,397 the street says, "Come here. 463 00:24:01,732 --> 00:24:03,566 "Your mom doesn't have groceries. 464 00:24:03,567 --> 00:24:05,902 "Your lights is out. You didn't have heat last week. 465 00:24:05,903 --> 00:24:07,904 You had to turn off the heat to keep the lights on." 466 00:24:07,905 --> 00:24:09,822 That's what my mom was doing. So, what she would do 467 00:24:09,823 --> 00:24:12,659 is like, say, "Okay, what could be sacrificed this month?" 468 00:24:12,660 --> 00:24:15,078 - Yeah. - Rent has to be paid. 469 00:24:15,079 --> 00:24:16,746 Right? And even sometimes she would-- 470 00:24:16,747 --> 00:24:20,083 they would do a thing where you go three months out 471 00:24:20,084 --> 00:24:21,751 and then they would take you to court 472 00:24:21,752 --> 00:24:24,712 and then you would pay, but you got the three months. 473 00:24:24,713 --> 00:24:26,924 You-- you got the three months where you can... 474 00:24:27,967 --> 00:24:30,426 You know, my mom was a hustler. She was trying to figure out 475 00:24:30,427 --> 00:24:32,929 how to-- how to make this thing work for four kids. 476 00:24:32,930 --> 00:24:35,098 My mom had four kids before she was 20. 477 00:24:35,099 --> 00:24:36,849 - I'm the last at 20. - Wow. 478 00:24:36,850 --> 00:24:38,851 And I look at that saying, 479 00:24:38,852 --> 00:24:42,271 man, I don't even know how to manage that. 480 00:24:42,272 --> 00:24:44,149 Four children at 20. 481 00:24:44,984 --> 00:24:46,859 So, the streets grab you for that. 482 00:24:46,860 --> 00:24:48,611 Like, you're not gonna help your mom? 483 00:24:48,612 --> 00:24:50,530 You gonna let you-- what, you watching your mom 484 00:24:50,531 --> 00:24:52,281 struggle like this? And, you know, 485 00:24:52,282 --> 00:24:54,117 go do something. Like, be a man. 486 00:24:54,118 --> 00:24:56,035 And there was no one else offering any other kind of jobs? 487 00:24:56,036 --> 00:24:57,662 No, no, there was no other kind of job. 488 00:24:57,663 --> 00:24:59,330 But we had, like, summer jobs. 489 00:24:59,331 --> 00:25:00,873 A couple hundred dollars, 490 00:25:00,874 --> 00:25:02,667 - couldn't be more than that, you know. - Yeah. 491 00:25:02,668 --> 00:25:04,877 So, you were talking earlier about Trenton. 492 00:25:04,878 --> 00:25:06,587 - We-- I-- I interrupted you. - So-- 493 00:25:06,588 --> 00:25:09,215 Let's go back to the difference in living in Trenton... 494 00:25:09,216 --> 00:25:10,883 - Mm-hmm. - ...versus living at Marcy. 495 00:25:10,884 --> 00:25:14,012 So, Marcy was this-- this environment 496 00:25:14,013 --> 00:25:18,725 from nine to 15 where I did some hustling. 497 00:25:18,726 --> 00:25:22,395 But it was-- I was mostly focused on music. 498 00:25:22,396 --> 00:25:24,480 Once I got to Trenton, we were living 499 00:25:24,481 --> 00:25:26,899 in a friend of mine's aunt's house, 500 00:25:26,900 --> 00:25:30,194 and the freedom we had was unbelievable. 501 00:25:30,195 --> 00:25:32,989 - No parents. - We're like, living like adults. 502 00:25:32,990 --> 00:25:35,700 And we were in and out hustling, paying all the bills 503 00:25:35,701 --> 00:25:37,577 in her house as well. 504 00:25:37,578 --> 00:25:39,412 So, I got further away from music. 505 00:25:39,413 --> 00:25:41,164 So, the little boy that was sitting at the table 506 00:25:41,165 --> 00:25:43,167 writing every day, I had no time. 507 00:25:44,084 --> 00:25:47,337 But because I trained my mind to work like that. 508 00:25:48,380 --> 00:25:49,922 You know, it's like anything else, 509 00:25:49,923 --> 00:25:52,258 three o'clock, these thoughts are coming back, 510 00:25:52,259 --> 00:25:53,509 'cause at three o'clock, 511 00:25:53,510 --> 00:25:55,845 I'm typically at the table writing. 512 00:25:55,846 --> 00:25:57,346 But now, I'm outside and I'm like, 513 00:25:57,347 --> 00:25:59,183 oh, I got a really good line. 514 00:26:00,142 --> 00:26:03,019 I gotta mem-- uh, let me memorize this. 515 00:26:03,020 --> 00:26:05,354 Now, to memorize this, I gotta hold onto it. 516 00:26:05,355 --> 00:26:07,607 And, you know, at first I start, you know, 517 00:26:07,608 --> 00:26:10,026 I couldn't and I would lose, like, I was like, dang, 518 00:26:10,027 --> 00:26:12,195 I know I had a really good line. What was it? 519 00:26:12,196 --> 00:26:14,238 It was... it was... 520 00:26:14,239 --> 00:26:17,283 And, you know, like, whole songs I've lost like that. 521 00:26:17,284 --> 00:26:20,036 - I mean, unbelievable material. - I bet. I bet. 522 00:26:20,037 --> 00:26:22,080 I've-- I've just-- just gone. 523 00:26:22,081 --> 00:26:23,414 - Yeah. - At some point, I was like, 524 00:26:23,415 --> 00:26:25,041 you know what, I'm gonna go in the store. 525 00:26:25,042 --> 00:26:27,251 I was outside on the corners and things like that. 526 00:26:27,252 --> 00:26:29,879 So, I would go in the store and write the idea 527 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:32,548 and then, like, ball the paper up and put it in my pocket. 528 00:26:32,549 --> 00:26:35,760 I wonder if it worked as a form of, 529 00:26:35,761 --> 00:26:37,261 I'll call it therapy. 530 00:26:37,262 --> 00:26:40,265 Like, if you're in a stressful situation... 531 00:26:41,391 --> 00:26:44,143 and you have this other thing you're doing... 532 00:26:44,144 --> 00:26:45,937 - Mm-hmm. - You know what I'm saying? 533 00:26:45,938 --> 00:26:47,939 - Yeah, of course, yeah. - You're occupying yourself... 534 00:26:47,940 --> 00:26:50,983 - Yeah. Yeah. - ...with something that's not this scary thing... 535 00:26:50,984 --> 00:26:52,568 - Yeah, yeah. - ...happening out here. 536 00:26:52,569 --> 00:26:56,072 - But, "I have this other life in my head." - Yeah. 537 00:26:56,073 --> 00:26:57,490 I never thought about it like that. 538 00:26:57,491 --> 00:26:59,660 That's-- That's-- That's, you know... 539 00:27:00,744 --> 00:27:03,162 I see that clear and I-- I recognize that. 540 00:27:03,163 --> 00:27:04,664 Thank you for that. 541 00:27:04,665 --> 00:27:09,293 I-- I thought-- how I saw it was, it was an exercise. 542 00:27:09,294 --> 00:27:10,920 Like, I built up my mind... 543 00:27:10,921 --> 00:27:13,005 - I see. - ...and memorized these things. 544 00:27:13,006 --> 00:27:15,007 But I guess it was therapy. 545 00:27:15,008 --> 00:27:19,637 It was a distraction from what was happening in my real life, 546 00:27:19,638 --> 00:27:21,472 the danger of what was happening. 547 00:27:21,473 --> 00:27:23,891 Like, anyone could pull up, you know. 548 00:27:23,892 --> 00:27:25,935 It could be a shootout, it could be a robbery. 549 00:27:25,936 --> 00:27:28,271 It could be the jump out, police, 550 00:27:28,272 --> 00:27:30,356 which was often the case. [chuckles] 551 00:27:30,357 --> 00:27:32,316 - Yeah. - You know, it wasn't like the police 552 00:27:32,317 --> 00:27:35,319 wasn't running down on us all the time. 553 00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:36,612 And then, you know, again, 554 00:27:36,613 --> 00:27:38,364 we started having more and more success. 555 00:27:38,365 --> 00:27:40,533 We started-- I moved further and further away 556 00:27:40,534 --> 00:27:43,786 from that pen, that pad. So, from Trenton, 557 00:27:43,787 --> 00:27:45,788 then we started moving into our own places. 558 00:27:45,789 --> 00:27:48,457 And then we start, you know, going further. 559 00:27:48,458 --> 00:27:50,626 Then, I went to Cambridge, Maryland. 560 00:27:50,627 --> 00:27:52,670 And then, I went to Virginia. It was like I was getting 561 00:27:52,671 --> 00:27:56,132 further and further away from this notepad. 562 00:27:56,133 --> 00:27:57,341 - Yeah. - You know? 563 00:27:57,342 --> 00:28:00,303 Um, so that's what, 11 years of your life. 564 00:28:00,304 --> 00:28:01,471 - Yeah. - Big. 565 00:28:02,848 --> 00:28:05,309 Yeah. Big danger and big risk. 566 00:28:06,351 --> 00:28:08,477 So, it sounds like you always were planning 567 00:28:08,478 --> 00:28:10,646 on coming back to music at some point. 568 00:28:10,647 --> 00:28:12,315 - Yeah. - Even when you were on-- on the corner. 569 00:28:12,316 --> 00:28:13,983 Yeah. 570 00:28:13,984 --> 00:28:17,278 Yeah, at some point, like, there became a thing 571 00:28:17,279 --> 00:28:19,488 where hustlers was making so much money 572 00:28:19,489 --> 00:28:21,157 that rappers was corny. 573 00:28:21,158 --> 00:28:23,159 So, I almost had to hide the fact 574 00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:25,203 that I wanted to be a rapper. 575 00:28:25,204 --> 00:28:28,456 It was like, you wanna be-- look at those guys. 576 00:28:28,457 --> 00:28:30,666 Like, you know, and then we would, like, go to shows, 577 00:28:30,667 --> 00:28:33,002 and, like, uh, rappers would pull up 578 00:28:33,003 --> 00:28:35,671 in like, Turtle Tops and minivans, 579 00:28:35,672 --> 00:28:38,216 and we was coming with, like, 4Runners 580 00:28:38,217 --> 00:28:41,720 and Lexus, and Acuras, and, like, "You wanna do that? 581 00:28:42,679 --> 00:28:44,847 - We already doing this, like..." - Yeah. 582 00:28:44,848 --> 00:28:46,682 "That-- that seems like a step backwards." 583 00:28:46,683 --> 00:28:49,685 In fact, my first record, Can't Knock the Hustle, 584 00:28:49,686 --> 00:28:52,730 I really was talking to the hustlers, 585 00:28:52,731 --> 00:28:56,400 "Who do you think you are? Maybe one day you'll be a star." 586 00:28:56,401 --> 00:28:58,361 - Yeah. - That was the feeling of, 587 00:28:58,362 --> 00:29:02,031 I wanted to be a rapper, and the hustlers 588 00:29:02,032 --> 00:29:05,201 looked down upon being a rapper at that time. 589 00:29:05,202 --> 00:29:06,369 Yeah. 590 00:29:06,370 --> 00:29:09,288 [♪ "Can't Knock the Hustle" playing] 591 00:29:09,289 --> 00:29:11,374 - It's fun. - Yeah, this is great. 592 00:29:11,375 --> 00:29:13,543 - Yeah, thank you. - ♪ Check, check, yo ♪ 593 00:29:55,168 --> 00:29:59,130 ♪ I'm taking out this time ♪ 594 00:29:59,131 --> 00:30:03,135 ♪ To give you a piece of my mind ♪ 595 00:30:05,429 --> 00:30:09,515 ♪ Who do you think you are? ♪ 596 00:30:09,516 --> 00:30:13,520 ♪ Baby, one day you'll be a star ♪ 597 00:30:46,178 --> 00:30:48,805 ♪ Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah ♪ 598 00:30:50,140 --> 00:30:51,849 ♪ But until then, lately ♪ 599 00:30:51,850 --> 00:30:53,476 Is the first record? 600 00:30:53,477 --> 00:30:55,144 - Yeah. Yeah. [chuckles] - Amazing. 601 00:30:55,145 --> 00:30:57,813 ♪ 'Cause that's the way you're making me feel ♪ 602 00:30:57,814 --> 00:31:01,317 [Jay-Z] I remember the feeling being like rap is my hustle. 603 00:31:01,318 --> 00:31:03,027 - Hustling was my job. - [Rick] Yeah. 604 00:31:03,028 --> 00:31:05,321 - "Don't Knock the Hustle" being about rap. - [Jay-Z] Yeah. 605 00:31:05,322 --> 00:31:06,989 - [Rick] Yeah. - [Jay-Z] Yeah. 606 00:31:06,990 --> 00:31:10,034 I remember hearing that you wanted your first album 607 00:31:10,035 --> 00:31:12,370 - to be your only album. - Yeah. 608 00:31:12,371 --> 00:31:13,829 - That was your original plan. - Yeah. 609 00:31:13,830 --> 00:31:15,706 - Tell me about that. - I don't know where that thought 610 00:31:15,707 --> 00:31:18,501 came from, but it was-- it was serious for me. 611 00:31:18,502 --> 00:31:20,169 - I had these goals. - Yeah. 612 00:31:20,170 --> 00:31:22,046 I'll have one record, it'll go gold. 613 00:31:22,047 --> 00:31:23,547 - I see. - And that'll be it. 614 00:31:23,548 --> 00:31:25,508 And then I'll have this company. 615 00:31:25,509 --> 00:31:28,928 I've always thought like a-- like a businessman. 616 00:31:28,929 --> 00:31:32,056 - Mm-hmm. - You know, it was like I was fighting the artist. 617 00:31:32,057 --> 00:31:34,558 I didn't love being an artist. I didn't like shooting videos. 618 00:31:34,559 --> 00:31:36,519 I didn't like interviews. I didn't like speaking. 619 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,105 - Yeah. - I was pretty much an introvert. 620 00:31:39,106 --> 00:31:41,190 This was the way I spoke. 621 00:31:41,191 --> 00:31:45,069 I would never talk like that if you were sitting around me. 622 00:31:45,070 --> 00:31:46,738 People that sat around me was like... 623 00:31:48,031 --> 00:31:50,866 Go look it up. Everyone says, "He was so quiet. 624 00:31:50,867 --> 00:31:52,701 He never said anything, bah, bah, bah." 625 00:31:52,702 --> 00:31:55,621 I would never talk, like, in those days. 626 00:31:55,622 --> 00:31:58,041 I would never have a conversation. 627 00:31:59,251 --> 00:32:02,629 You know, it-- and it was part of the, you know... 628 00:32:03,547 --> 00:32:04,964 my job. 629 00:32:04,965 --> 00:32:07,550 You're not talking to people, keep yourself sane, 630 00:32:07,551 --> 00:32:09,051 stay in the shadows. 631 00:32:09,052 --> 00:32:10,970 You a hustler and you gonna be on TV? 632 00:32:10,971 --> 00:32:13,472 - That goes against everything. "Who are you?" - Yeah, just the opposite. 633 00:32:13,473 --> 00:32:15,225 There's no early footage of me. 634 00:32:17,144 --> 00:32:19,395 I would never let any cameras come around me. 635 00:32:19,396 --> 00:32:21,063 - Mm. - Film me? 636 00:32:21,064 --> 00:32:22,398 Oh, no, we gonna have a fight. 637 00:32:22,399 --> 00:32:24,775 Like, there's gonna be a problem filming me. 638 00:32:24,776 --> 00:32:26,903 Yeah, so everything I was doing was... 639 00:32:27,821 --> 00:32:30,240 counterintuitive to how I lived. 640 00:32:31,283 --> 00:32:32,909 And I didn't-- I didn't like... 641 00:32:34,161 --> 00:32:35,786 the music business. 642 00:32:35,787 --> 00:32:37,621 I wanted to do it 'cause I had a dream 643 00:32:37,622 --> 00:32:40,332 and I had a talent to do it, but I didn't-- 644 00:32:40,333 --> 00:32:42,084 - I didn't wanna be in-- - Yeah. 645 00:32:42,085 --> 00:32:44,086 You didn't aspire to be an artist. 646 00:32:44,087 --> 00:32:45,838 I didn't aspire to be an artist. 647 00:32:45,839 --> 00:32:48,591 Yeah. So, I was like, I'm gonna do this 648 00:32:48,592 --> 00:32:51,093 and then I'll have a company, 649 00:32:51,094 --> 00:32:53,137 and, you know, I'll be Russell Simmons. 650 00:32:53,138 --> 00:32:56,182 - [chuckles] Yeah. - Yeah. And then, another last album. 651 00:32:56,183 --> 00:32:57,683 When you did The Black Album, 652 00:32:57,684 --> 00:33:00,186 it was-- you were planning on retiring at that point, too. 653 00:33:00,187 --> 00:33:02,438 I think that was more just exhaustion. 654 00:33:02,439 --> 00:33:05,774 I just was at-- from '96, 655 00:33:05,775 --> 00:33:07,276 '97, another album. 656 00:33:07,277 --> 00:33:08,861 - '98, another album. - Every year. 657 00:33:08,862 --> 00:33:12,948 '99. Every year, a album. In between, features on this, 658 00:33:12,949 --> 00:33:15,326 movie soundtracks here, 659 00:33:15,327 --> 00:33:17,453 shows, tours in between. 660 00:33:17,454 --> 00:33:22,124 It was like this nonstop pace of recording and making music. 661 00:33:22,125 --> 00:33:25,711 And I had never stopped to say, I'm not actually living. 662 00:33:25,712 --> 00:33:28,047 I had fun. Don't get me wrong. 663 00:33:28,048 --> 00:33:30,132 - But it's work. - And it was always work. 664 00:33:30,133 --> 00:33:31,717 It's fun, but you don't have a choice. 665 00:33:31,718 --> 00:33:33,802 - Yeah. - Because you showed up. 666 00:33:33,803 --> 00:33:36,055 Never missed a show. Never was late. 667 00:33:36,056 --> 00:33:39,850 Always just on time, always just nonstop work ethic 668 00:33:39,851 --> 00:33:42,561 and just always creating. 669 00:33:42,562 --> 00:33:44,271 You know, and I went too far with it. 670 00:33:44,272 --> 00:33:46,690 And-- and I really felt like in my heart I was like, 671 00:33:46,691 --> 00:33:49,818 you know how you get that-- those feelings like, I'm done. 672 00:33:49,819 --> 00:33:51,654 I'm done with this. I gotta do something else. 673 00:33:51,655 --> 00:33:53,697 I don't wanna just make music just to make music. 674 00:33:53,698 --> 00:33:54,908 And what do I have to say? 675 00:33:55,909 --> 00:33:57,743 I think a better thing in hindsight 676 00:33:57,744 --> 00:33:59,454 would have been just to step away. 677 00:34:00,288 --> 00:34:03,082 You know, and I didn't-- I didn't step away for long. 678 00:34:03,083 --> 00:34:06,210 It came right back, maybe like two years later. 679 00:34:06,211 --> 00:34:08,838 Would you say you write all the time? 680 00:34:10,090 --> 00:34:12,341 Yeah. Yeah. 681 00:34:12,342 --> 00:34:14,009 What will inspire? 682 00:34:14,010 --> 00:34:16,345 Will it be a thought or will it be something in the world? 683 00:34:16,346 --> 00:34:18,764 What inspires something to come? 684 00:34:18,765 --> 00:34:20,474 Life. 685 00:34:20,475 --> 00:34:22,601 Life, wherever I am at that moment, like-- 686 00:34:22,602 --> 00:34:24,520 It might start with a phrase or a thought? 687 00:34:24,521 --> 00:34:26,188 A phrase, a saying. 688 00:34:26,189 --> 00:34:27,523 - Yeah. - Or something. 689 00:34:27,524 --> 00:34:30,109 It's just like everyday, like, life inspiring you. 690 00:34:30,110 --> 00:34:32,820 ♪ Turn the music up, turn me down ♪ 691 00:34:32,821 --> 00:34:34,197 [♪ "What More Can I Say" playing] 692 00:35:07,606 --> 00:35:09,065 That's incredible. 693 00:35:27,667 --> 00:35:32,921 ♪ What more can I say ♪ 694 00:35:32,922 --> 00:35:36,008 So, in this song, first verse is like, um, 695 00:35:36,009 --> 00:35:38,010 "I'm not a biter, I'm a writer for myself and others. 696 00:35:38,011 --> 00:35:40,095 I say a B.I.G. verse, I'm only bigging up my brother." 697 00:35:40,096 --> 00:35:43,098 Biggie Smalls, who had passed at that time. 698 00:35:43,099 --> 00:35:46,101 You know, and a song on Volume One, 699 00:35:46,102 --> 00:35:48,103 I say, "I'm gonna make sure a world with no thing 700 00:35:48,104 --> 00:35:49,313 remember your name." 701 00:35:49,314 --> 00:35:51,607 So, part of it was like paying homage 702 00:35:51,608 --> 00:35:53,776 and, like, saying, like, little bits and pieces 703 00:35:53,777 --> 00:35:55,444 of, uh, B.I.G.'s song. 704 00:35:55,445 --> 00:35:57,821 And then, it became this thing of, like, me-- 705 00:35:57,822 --> 00:36:00,032 out of all the songs I made, 706 00:36:00,033 --> 00:36:02,618 you know, that I was taking Biggie Smalls 707 00:36:02,619 --> 00:36:03,994 to create my career. 708 00:36:03,995 --> 00:36:06,331 And I address it on this song. 709 00:36:07,123 --> 00:36:09,958 And I thought about it, I'm like, "Man, rap and music 710 00:36:09,959 --> 00:36:13,587 is based on homage, and samples, and--" 711 00:36:13,588 --> 00:36:15,631 - Absolutely. - So, what am I talking about? 712 00:36:15,632 --> 00:36:18,050 I remember the first time I heard that happen, 713 00:36:18,051 --> 00:36:21,303 Snoop had done La Di Da Di over. 714 00:36:21,304 --> 00:36:23,806 And I was like, "This is really good. 715 00:36:23,807 --> 00:36:25,849 - Can he do that?" - Cover song. 716 00:36:25,850 --> 00:36:28,227 We never cover songs, like, in hip-hop. 717 00:36:28,228 --> 00:36:30,479 You know, they do it all the time in country 718 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:32,731 - and rock, et cetera, et cetera. - Can you say the words? 719 00:36:32,732 --> 00:36:34,191 - Of this song? - Yeah. 720 00:36:34,192 --> 00:36:36,652 - Tell me the verse. - On What More Can I Say? 721 00:36:36,653 --> 00:36:38,696 "Never had a nigga done good this long, 722 00:36:38,697 --> 00:36:41,532 "this hood or this pop, this hot or this strong, 723 00:36:41,533 --> 00:36:44,326 "with so many different flows. This one's for this song. 724 00:36:44,327 --> 00:36:47,496 The next one I switch up. This one will get bit up." 725 00:36:47,497 --> 00:36:49,039 - I mean, there's so many people... - Yeah. 726 00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:51,375 ...that say all my lyrics, like... 727 00:36:51,376 --> 00:36:53,085 In defense of myself, there's, like... 728 00:36:53,086 --> 00:36:55,754 - Yeah. [laughing] - ...way more of my lyrics and people-- 729 00:36:55,755 --> 00:36:57,214 "This one to get bit up. 730 00:36:57,215 --> 00:36:59,341 "These fucks too lazy to make up shit. 731 00:36:59,342 --> 00:37:01,176 "They crazy. They don't paint pictures. 732 00:37:01,177 --> 00:37:03,095 "They just trace me. You know what? 733 00:37:03,096 --> 00:37:05,389 "Soon they forget where they pluck their whole style from, 734 00:37:05,390 --> 00:37:06,598 "then try to reverse the outcome, 735 00:37:06,599 --> 00:37:07,850 "I'm like, 'Tah.' 736 00:37:07,851 --> 00:37:09,685 - [laughing] - "I'm not a biter, I'm a writer 737 00:37:09,686 --> 00:37:11,186 "for myself and others. 738 00:37:11,187 --> 00:37:13,564 "I say a B.I.G. verse, I'm only bigging up my brother, 739 00:37:13,565 --> 00:37:15,858 "Bigging up my borough, I'm big enough to do it. 740 00:37:15,859 --> 00:37:17,401 "I'm that thorough, plus I know 741 00:37:17,402 --> 00:37:19,445 my own flow is foolish. So them rings--" 742 00:37:19,446 --> 00:37:21,029 - And there's a B.I.G. verse. Then you go... - Yeah. 743 00:37:21,030 --> 00:37:23,240 "The rings and things you sing about, bring 'em out." 744 00:37:23,241 --> 00:37:26,118 Is it different, um, recalling words 745 00:37:26,119 --> 00:37:28,036 when you don't hear the music? 746 00:37:28,037 --> 00:37:30,080 Mm, it's a good question. 747 00:37:30,081 --> 00:37:31,540 I never thought about that. 748 00:37:31,541 --> 00:37:34,794 I guess-- I guess the music would help a bit. 749 00:37:35,712 --> 00:37:37,337 Um, but nah, I just-- 750 00:37:37,338 --> 00:37:39,047 I hadn't heard that in so long, like... 751 00:37:39,048 --> 00:37:41,216 How long did you have to start preparing to do that? 752 00:37:41,217 --> 00:37:43,051 - Like, if you know you have a show coming up... - Yeah. 753 00:37:43,052 --> 00:37:45,137 ...and not doing it for four years, how long do you start-- 754 00:37:45,138 --> 00:37:48,390 I'm supposed to do it a month ahead, but I never do. 755 00:37:48,391 --> 00:37:51,059 - [laughing] - I always wait till the last week. 756 00:37:51,060 --> 00:37:52,936 It's just something about it, like something-- 757 00:37:52,937 --> 00:37:55,607 some-- some kind of freshness to it when I'm... 758 00:37:56,733 --> 00:37:58,984 nervous about not knowing the next line. 759 00:37:58,985 --> 00:38:01,738 Let's talk about that. Would you say that pressure... 760 00:38:03,448 --> 00:38:07,242 makes you better or undermines you? 761 00:38:07,243 --> 00:38:10,412 I definitely run towards the pressure. 762 00:38:10,413 --> 00:38:13,081 - Even when we did Unplugged with Quest and The Roots... - Yeah. 763 00:38:13,082 --> 00:38:15,667 ...we didn't rehearse till the day before. 764 00:38:15,668 --> 00:38:17,836 And he was like, "What are you doing?" 765 00:38:17,837 --> 00:38:19,755 I'm like, something about it, like just-- 766 00:38:19,756 --> 00:38:22,091 it-- it's something about it that makes you play. 767 00:38:24,260 --> 00:38:26,178 - You're not acting. - Yeah, you're living it. 768 00:38:26,179 --> 00:38:27,846 - It's-- it's the moment. - You're living it, you haven't-- 769 00:38:27,847 --> 00:38:29,932 you haven't rehearsed it so much that you're just... 770 00:38:29,933 --> 00:38:31,934 'Cause if I know it so much, I'm gonna check out. 771 00:38:31,935 --> 00:38:33,268 My mind wanders. 772 00:38:33,269 --> 00:38:34,770 You have a way that works for you, so it's-- 773 00:38:34,771 --> 00:38:36,480 - Yeah. - There is no right or wrong way. 774 00:38:36,481 --> 00:38:38,440 - Yeah. Yeah. - It's-- the beauty is finding the way that works. 775 00:38:38,441 --> 00:38:42,027 Also, when the last song started, it starts with, 776 00:38:42,028 --> 00:38:43,654 "Turn the music up, turn me down." 777 00:38:43,655 --> 00:38:46,281 And normally, on most records, 778 00:38:46,282 --> 00:38:48,283 you wouldn't get to hear that. You wouldn't get to hear 779 00:38:48,284 --> 00:38:50,911 the instructions to the engineer. 780 00:38:50,912 --> 00:38:55,123 - And it gives it much more of a documentary feeling of... - Yeah. 781 00:38:55,124 --> 00:38:57,835 ...this is really happening right now, this is live. 782 00:38:57,836 --> 00:38:59,461 - Yeah. - And you do it on many songs. 783 00:38:59,462 --> 00:39:01,630 Yeah, yeah. Having full conversation. 784 00:39:01,631 --> 00:39:03,674 "Turn the lights up." And that was, like, real conversation. 785 00:39:03,675 --> 00:39:04,967 - I know. I know. - [chuckles] Yeah. 786 00:39:04,968 --> 00:39:06,218 When was the idea like, 787 00:39:06,219 --> 00:39:08,303 "I'm gonna keep this in the record"? 788 00:39:08,304 --> 00:39:10,222 I don't even know. I-- I feel like the first-- 789 00:39:10,223 --> 00:39:12,474 Was there a decision made or did it just happen at first? 790 00:39:12,475 --> 00:39:13,976 It just-- I think it just happened, I think-- 791 00:39:13,977 --> 00:39:16,019 I think around Hard Knock Life, 792 00:39:16,020 --> 00:39:17,980 because I was really going through the drums, 793 00:39:17,981 --> 00:39:21,359 like, "Turn the drums down. Turn-- take the bass out." 794 00:39:22,694 --> 00:39:25,195 'Cause I wanted to rap over just the drums. 795 00:39:25,196 --> 00:39:26,989 - Yeah. - Okay, and it was like, 796 00:39:26,990 --> 00:39:28,490 "Maybe not, put the bass back in." 797 00:39:28,491 --> 00:39:31,827 - Like, and I'm really trying to find the space. - Yeah. 798 00:39:31,828 --> 00:39:33,579 - And it just dropped so good. - Yeah. 799 00:39:33,580 --> 00:39:35,998 It's the first time I remember. It could have been before that. 800 00:39:35,999 --> 00:39:37,916 - Mm-hmm. - But that's the first time I remember 801 00:39:37,917 --> 00:39:39,501 leaving in, like, the talk. 802 00:39:39,502 --> 00:39:41,128 - Yeah, the direction. Yeah. - Yeah. 803 00:39:41,129 --> 00:39:43,839 Well, then back to B.I.G., one of my favorite applications 804 00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:46,341 of this is a song called Victory. 805 00:39:46,342 --> 00:39:48,343 Biggie is talking. 806 00:39:48,344 --> 00:39:50,220 [singsong] "Your time won't last forever." 807 00:39:50,221 --> 00:39:52,890 [mumbling indistinctly] "Turn the music up. 808 00:39:52,891 --> 00:39:54,725 No, sir, I need that shit knocking." 809 00:39:54,726 --> 00:39:57,019 - I'm like... [chuckles] - Amazing. 810 00:39:57,020 --> 00:39:58,562 - Yeah. - Amazing. 811 00:39:58,563 --> 00:40:01,023 [♪ "Hard Knock Life (Ghetto Anthem)" playing] 812 00:40:01,024 --> 00:40:02,442 ♪ Take the bass line out ♪ 813 00:40:03,443 --> 00:40:04,527 ♪ Uh-huh ♪ 814 00:40:05,570 --> 00:40:07,237 ♪ Jigga ♪ 815 00:40:07,238 --> 00:40:09,573 ♪ Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh, yeah, let it bump though ♪ 816 00:40:09,574 --> 00:40:12,701 ♪ It's a hard knock life for us ♪ 817 00:40:12,702 --> 00:40:15,704 ♪ It's a hard knock life for us ♪ 818 00:40:15,705 --> 00:40:18,874 ♪ Instead of treated, we get tricked ♪ 819 00:40:18,875 --> 00:40:21,919 ♪ Instead of kisses, we get kicked ♪ 820 00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:25,088 - ♪ It's a hard knock life ♪ - ♪ From standing on the corners boppin' ♪ 821 00:40:25,089 --> 00:40:28,258 ♪ To driving some of the hottest cars New York has ever seen ♪ 822 00:40:28,259 --> 00:40:31,261 ♪ For dropping some of the hottest verses rappers ever heard ♪ 823 00:40:31,262 --> 00:40:32,971 ♪ From the dope spot with the smoke Glock ♪ 824 00:40:32,972 --> 00:40:35,307 ♪ Fleeing the murder scene, you know me well ♪ 825 00:40:35,308 --> 00:40:38,352 ♪ From nightmares of a lonely cell, my only hell ♪ 826 00:40:38,353 --> 00:40:41,438 ♪ But since when y'all niggas know me to fail, fuck naw ♪ 827 00:40:41,439 --> 00:40:44,566 ♪ Where all my niggas with the rubber grips, bust shots ♪ 828 00:40:44,567 --> 00:40:47,611 ♪ And if you with me, mama, rub on your tits and whatnot ♪ 829 00:40:47,612 --> 00:40:50,822 ♪ I'm from the school of the hard knocks, we must not ♪ 830 00:40:50,823 --> 00:40:53,909 ♪ Let outsiders violate our blocks and my plot ♪ 831 00:40:53,910 --> 00:40:56,995 ♪ Let's stick up the world and split it 50/50, uh-huh ♪ 832 00:40:56,996 --> 00:41:00,082 ♪ Let's take the dough and stay real jiggy, uh-huh ♪ 833 00:41:00,083 --> 00:41:03,293 ♪ And sip the Cris and get pissy-pissy, flow infinitely ♪ 834 00:41:03,294 --> 00:41:06,421 ♪ Like the memory of my nigga Biggie, baby ♪ 835 00:41:06,422 --> 00:41:08,757 ♪ You know it's hell when I come through ♪ 836 00:41:08,758 --> 00:41:11,718 ♪ The life and times of Shawn Carter, nigga, volume two ♪ 837 00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:15,138 - ♪ Y'all nigga's been ready ♪ - ♪ It's a hard knock life for us ♪ 838 00:41:15,139 --> 00:41:18,058 ♪ It's a hard knock life for us ♪ 839 00:41:18,059 --> 00:41:21,228 ♪ Instead of treated, we get tricked ♪ 840 00:41:21,229 --> 00:41:24,314 ♪ Instead of kisses, we get kicked ♪ 841 00:41:24,315 --> 00:41:25,816 ♪ It's a hard knock life ♪ 842 00:41:25,817 --> 00:41:27,734 ♪ I flow for those 'dro'ed out ♪ 843 00:41:27,735 --> 00:41:29,987 ♪ All my niggas locked down in the 10 by four ♪ 844 00:41:29,988 --> 00:41:32,615 ♪ Controlling the house, we live in hard knocks... ♪